687 replies to this topic

[Rad-oh-yeah?]

https://joesaward.wo...lity-and-sense/

 

...the issue at the moment is the question of whether or not it is fair that Honda has to homologate its engines at the end of February while its rivals can do it later simply because someone forgot to put a date in the regulations for 2015. Frankly, it is embarrassing that such questions should even have to be asked and it is not very sporting for the other manufacturers to do what they are doing, but we know that sportsmanship is not a concept that all of them understand, and that fair competition makes their achievements all the better. In such an atmosphere, what can one expect? F1 people are so obsessed by winning that they cannot take a step back and understand that they are behaving like spoilt children. Honda cannot have a delayed homologation because it has not had an engine that was used previously and so the only sensible solution is to stick with the homologation date intended and overlook the screw-up.

 

Sto bi reklo - svi timovi moraju da homologuju motore za sezonu 2015. do 28. februara i nema daljeg razvoja.

[alpiner]

FIA considering Honda rules rethink

The FIA is considering whether or not it should make further changes to Formula 1 rules, following a meeting with Honda this week.

Representatives of the Japanese car manufacturer met with F1 race director Charlie Whiting on Monday for discussions about the governing body's stance to the engine homologation rules.

Honda is unhappy that a rules clarification issued by the FIA at the end of last year allows its rival to continue developing their engines throughout 2015, while its own power unit must remain frozen.

It feels that the decision by the FIA to impose on it a February 28 homologation date, with no room for it to update its engine until next winter, will put it at a disadvantage.

But with FIA sources having made clear that Honda had never been due any freedom to upgrade its engine anyway, and remains free to keep working on it unhindered until the end of next month, there remained differing views about just how much the rules interpretation would hold it back.

Although no details of what was agreed in Monday's meeting have been revealed, it is understood the discussions went well and the FIA has agreed to reconsider the matter.

However, although talks between Honda and the FIA on the situation are likely to continue, there is no guarantee that Honda will get any of the concessions it would like.

If the FIA decides that Honda should be treated differently though, then it could allow it the same 32 development tokens that Ferrari, Renault and Mercedes are allowed to use to improve their power units this season.

That would then put it on the same development path over future campaigns without it feeling that it has been put at a disadvantage by joining the new turbo rules formula a year later than everyone else.

However, giving Honda too much freedom could leave Renault, Ferrari and Mercedes upset, because some of their design has been totally frozen for nearly 12 months now, during which time Honda has been able to take on board lessons and improve its own concept.

https://uk.eurosport...636619--f1.html

[Rad-oh-yeah?]

http://www.crash.net...st-victory.html

 

Ferrari: Engine development ‘first victory’


Ferrari chairman Sergio Marchionne has described the engine loophole which will allow manufacturers to make changes to the power units during 2015 as “a first victory”.

The FIA conceded earlier this month that the lack of a specific date in the sporting regulations for homologating engines means Mercedes, Renault and Ferrari will be allowed to introduce updates at any time during the coming season. Marchionne is keen to warn Ferrari fans that the team is facing a difficult season in 2015 but says the power unit loophole has been a welcome boost which gives it more chance of making improvements.

“I would like to say to the Tifosi: 'Let us work',” Marchionne said at the Detroit Motor Show. “I will go to a few races this year, but we have a team boss and it will be for him to take care of the day-to-day running of the team.

“However, we are starting from behind. I'm focused on finding a way to get back to the top as soon as possible and get Ferrari winning again. It will be a tough year, but the important thing is to keep our heads down.

“We already have had a good result, being able to modify the engines during the season, when it looked like everything had to remain frozen. I consider that a first victory. Now let's hope some others follow.”
 

[Downforce]

Jaka vam pobeda u pm...retko ogavno stvorenje. Kakav mentalni sklop...

 

[Rad-oh-yeah?]

Winning
January 14, 2015 by Joe Saward


If Ferrari president Sergio Marchionne says his team has achieved its first victory of 2015 by finding a loophole in the regulations to allow it to apply some of its in-season engine development work later in the year, rather than at the end of February, he has a pretty strange view about what success really is.

It is pretty doubtful that Ferrari will win races this year even with this advantage and given the team's form in recent years the advantage of the loophole will probably be better used by Red Bull so that Ferrari will probably still be looking at fourth place in the Constructors' Championship.

The only sense where one might call it a victory is that by trying to nobble the McLaren-Honda challenge, Ferrari may avoid the disgrace of slipping to fifth in the Constructors', which would be the team's worst result in the title race since 1981. And that would be really embarrassing when one considers the amount of money that Ferrari is paid in addition to its prize money. And remember, that is not a meagre sum. Ferrari gets about $120 million from the Formula One group before there are any other prize fund payments. In theory this is because the team has been around longer than all the other teams and has more fans. This is true, but the payments are not really because of that, but rather because Ferrari's popularity gives it perceived importance and so Bernie Ecclestone has always paid the Italian team first in order to divide and conquer the teams. The idea that Ferrari should stand on its own two feet and fight on equal terms seems to be beyond the comprehension of these so-called sportsmen.

When you stop and think about it, a decent European Commission investigation into the sport could easily work in favour of the Formula One group. If the extra cash that is given to the big teams was redistributed on a fairer basis, it might be possible to end up with the Formula One group actually getting MORE money than it does today, although that might require some concessions such as actually promoting the sport, rather than just taking money from it. A fairer distribution of the money in F1 would solve the problems of weak teams and bring an end to all the time-wasting quibbles between them.

That would be good, although one can see why it might also be dangerous because they might one day unite against the commercial rights holder and demand a great deal more money.

 

Sve dok se timovi ponasaju kao da je F1 - sa aspekta biznisa, ne takmicenja na stazi - igra nulte sume u kojoj je moja pobeda uvek jednaka sumi vasih gubitaka, Berni i njegovi satrapi ce moci da rade sta hoce. Ako bi timovi poceli da rade zajedno na uzdizanju cele F1 na jedan visi nivo mozda bi se neko morao odreci odredjenog procenta kolaca u korist konkurencije ali bi ukupno gledano svi bili na dobitku. Ferari bi u nekoj jacoj, interesantnijoj, konkurentnijoj F1 lagano mogao da zaradi duplo ovo sto sada na lepe oci dobija od Bernija, a ostalo bi i za ostale timove pa i za Marusije i Ketereme ovog sveta. Mozda bismo onda ponovo imali pun grid od 26 bolida i neizvesnost u trkama i sampionatu.

[Rad-oh-yeah?]

Cestitam Mercedesu na osvajanju titule u sezoni 2015:

 

Mercedes has reportedly dismissed claims it will begin the 2015 season with its 'old' V6 engine of last year.

 

With the FIA agreeing to allow a development loophole under the existing 'freeze' rules, the sport's engine makers are currently contemplating how best to deploy their 32 upgrade 'tokens' throughout the 2015 season.

 

One rumour this week suggested Mercedes, having utterly dominated last year with its title-winning turbo V6, in fact planned to start the season with the 2014 unit in order to strategically upgrade to a 2015 specification over time.

 

But Italy's Omnicorse insists those reports are untrue, claiming the Brackley team is "assembling the car that will be taken to the Jerez test, and it will have the power unit configuration of 2015".

 

"The rumour that has spread in recent days about Mercedes doing the first four races with the 2014 power unit was denied," the report added.

 

Not only that, Omnicorse claims that Mercedes' 2015 engine will be significantly different this year, including a new Bosch injection system capable of turbo pressure to the regulations-maximum of 500 bar.

 

The report claimed Mercedes' 2014 turbo was limited to little more than half that figure.

 

[Hertzog]

To je bila javna tajna da imaju dosta rezerve, ali ovo je previse

[DASUBO]

Nije to nikakvo iznenađenje. Motor M178 u varijanti ugrađenoj u novi AMG GT razvija pritisak do 130 bar-a. Zvanično.

 

 

Svojim očima sam video pikove od preko 230 bar-a. A pričamo o motoru koji mora da dohvati šestocifrenu kilometražu. Prošle godine su išli konzervativno samo i jedino iz razloga pouzdanosti, a mogu da se kladim da su na testiranjima posle sezone u jababdabababbiju "odršafili" svih 500 bar-a.

[staneC]

Mislim, da če razlika izmedju Mercedesa i Ferrarija/Renaulta/(Honde) smanjivati.

Svima su poznate prednosti i zaostaci prvog i ostalih i siguran sam, da svi ti mozgovi o zaostalim ekipama   rade več ohoho vremena na poboljšavanju motora. Što si bliže limitu, teže je drastično poboljšanje. Što si više dnu, veči su skokovi moguči.

Sad, ako je katastrofalan zaheb u konstrukciji i kod Renaulta, Ferrarija i (najmanje moguče) Honde, i njihovi su motori blizu limita, onda nema smisla i Mercedes če pobedjivati dok god se ne promena pravila. Iz temelja.

 

Moje laično razmišljanje.

[alpiner]

Honda still not happy with unfreeze ruling

F1 returnee Honda this year may be allowed to do just a quarter of the engine development of its 2015 rivals Mercedes, Ferrari and Renault.

After initially being left out of the new engine 'unfreeze', the FIA relented and has permitted the Japanese manufacturer to do some in-season upgrading this year.

The FIA's complex Honda ruling allows McLaren's new works supplier to do development based on the average number of 'tokens' left over by its rivals at the start of the forthcoming season.

2014 suppliers Mercedes, Ferrari and Renault all have 32 'tokens' to deploy either before or after the start of the 2015 championship in Melbourne.

For instance, if Mercedes has 8 tokens left in Melbourne, Ferrari has 6 and Renault 4, Honda will be allowed to use the average number of tokens in 2015 -- 6.

Until now, Honda's likely allowance has been merely hypothetical.

But now Michael Schmidt, the highly respected correspondent for Germany's Auto Motor und Sport, claims to have more information about the plans of Honda's engine rivals.

We reported some days ago that Mercedes' plan could be to start the new season with essentially the title-winning 2014 engine, leaving a full complement of 32 tokens to deploy throughout the 20 races this season.

But Schmidt quoted a spokesman for the German team as confirming that Mercedes will in fact start the season with the 2015-specification turbo V6.

He said the reason for Mercedes' change of plans is precisely because of the Honda ruling. If Mercedes had gone into Melbourne with 32 tokens, Honda's 'average' number would have been dramatically increased.

So Schmidt said Mercedes will probably fly into Melbourne with only 6 tokens left in the luggage.

Renault, on the other hand, will reportedly have 7 left, and Ferrari 12, leaving Honda with an average of just 8 tokens to deploy in 2015.

But according to the Spanish sports daily AS, Honda is still not happy with the arguable fairness of its development scope under the FIA's new ruling.

"They are asking for a further clarification," the newspaper claims. "They want to be like everyone else, with 32 tokens for development."

http://www.grandprix...s/ns29799.html?

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Buka:

Illien says tweaks would make V6 engines louder

Mario Illien says it is possible tweaks to the current generation of turbo V6 cars can produce a louder sound for Formula One.

The most controversial aspect of the new 'power unit' regulations, introduced last year, is their mild tone in comparison to the screaming V8 and V10s of the past.

Bernie Ecclestone is still pushing hard for changes, and while some solutions were studied and trialled in 2014, the sport will enter a second season in 2015 with the same quieter sound.

But Mario Illien, the famous F1 engine designer who is now working with Renault and Red Bull, has told Germany's Auto Motor und Sport that there are some possible solutions that could make the basic V6 layout louder.

Could be louder, easily

He said the biggest problem is the way the engines' 'wastegate' is currently laid out.

"It does not blow into the atmosphere, but into the exhaust, which is very long and quite thick and the sound is lost," Illien said.

He said if another valve exits separately, "the sound that the engine makes would go directly to the outside and you'd hear it a lot better", Illien predicted.

He cautioned, however, that his solution would only produce more noise in certain 'phases' of the power unit operation, such as when the battery charge is full.

"In the race, the benefit would be less," he admitted.

Wastegate positioning mandated by FIA

Illien also said the current regulations prescribe the position of the wastegate, speculating: "The FIA was probably concerned it would (otherwise) be used for some aerodynamic tricks".

He also said a shorter exhaust would help, while the typical turbo whistle would be louder in F1 if a bi-turbo was introduced.

And Illien said that if the current maximum fuel-flow rate was increased, the sound of the engine would also be turned up.

http://www.motorspor...ngines-louder/?

[alpiner]

Malaysian Grand Prix boss Razlan Razali  recently told Reuters as quoted by the BBC: 'We were concerned after the feedback from Australia. Very concerned. When it finally came to Malaysia [last year], I didn't like it. It was simply too quiet. 

However Razali has since changed his mind, believing that Formula One with a quieter sound actually becomes a lot more family friendly.

'I noticed in the grandstands is that you get families with kids watching and enjoying Formula 1 better.

'I can remember in the past where a dad would put headphones on the kid and hold it. Or a kid would be too scared and start crying, wanting to go home. I think it attracts a new breed of fanbase now. And that's what you want.' 

Posle boldovanog dolazak kući i rečenica: "Eto kako si ga vaspitala!!!"

[Rad-oh-yeah?]

Lorenzo De Luca @LorenzoDL83

#AMuS "#Ferrari wants to go back to 2.2-liter V8 biturbo @ 17,000rpm/min, without MGU-H, but with standard KERS unit and turbocharger"

 

Pacenici.

 

Tobias Grüner F1 @tgruener

#F1 Mercedes wants to change as little as possible. Especially no standard turbo. Agreed increase of fuel & fuel flow limits for more power.

#F1 Honda open for new engine development. During the discussion, Honda mentioned idea of 4 electrical in-hub motors.

Introduction of new #F1 engine formula probably not before 2017. If manufacurers can't agree, Ecclestone threatens to decide on his own.

 

  Otkud njemu pravo na to?

Edited by Rad-oh-yeah?, 23 January 2015 - 19:50.

[alpiner]

Renault seeking ‘at least five wins’ in F1 2015

Renault has set itself a cautious goal of 'five wins' in the 2015 Formula 1 World Championship as it attempts to claw back ground on the dominant might of Mercedes.

The French engine constructor powered Red Bull Racing to four consecutive world titles between 2010 and 2013, but struggled to get an early grasp on the new hybrid power units introduced for 2014 with a series of reliability issues and a deficit of power compared with its Mercedes-equipped rivals.

However, Renault heads into the 2015 F1 season with just the two Red Bull teams on its books following the defection of Lotus to Mercedes and the presumed exit of Caterham.

With just two teams to supply, Renault Sport's Cyril Abitboul is confident this greater focus will enable it to close the margin on Mercedes, even if its expectations don't go too far beyond the three wins it achieved in 2014 with Daniel Ricciardo.

“We estimated there was a gap of about 60bhp with our engine compared to the Mercedes at the end of the 2014 season,” he told Canal +. “We hope to close this gap by half from the start of the season in Melbourne.

“Unlike Mercedes, we will start the 2015 season with a new 2015 version of our engine, as well as Red Bull Toro Rosso. Renault's goal is to score at least five wins this season.”

Renault's hopes of closing the gap on Mercedes are pinned on the much discussed 'engine unfreeze', which will see teams granted 32 'tokens' worth of upgrades on the existing engine. To date, Abitboul says Renault has used most of its tokens so far.

“To date, we have used about two-thirds of allowed tokens (32) to change our engine this year. “

Pre-season testing gets underway in Jerez in February 1st.

http://www.crash.net...tm_campaign=rss

[alpiner]

Ceo motor je "raspoređen" na 66 tokena pa je ovih 32 blizu 50% promena. Redizajn klipa je jedan token, ignition system dva...

 

Svake godine broj tokena se smanjuje za oko 9%