100 replies to this topic

[sabahudin]

e,
a KEVE mi,
kao klinac, znao sam da letim, lebdim, onako po sobi, kevvve mi..
vremenom, zaboravih
jasno vam je da tada nisam poznavao nikake droge ili alkohol, o hipnozi, autosugestiji, masti etc. nista nisam znao, samo hooop, i letim...uha
jos sam nedavno i zenu ubedjivao, i decu, da sam to znao. mislim da mi je najmladja cerka poverovala.


manecnissdaeditujem

Edited by sabahudin, 30 September 2003 - 10:20.

[AntiMaterija]

Ne znam kako da pojasnim ono što sam napisao, kad ni sam ne znam više o tom doživaljaju.
To je bilo dosta davno, pa mi je i sećanje o tome delimično izbledelo.

Jedino što sam siguran je taj "pogled odozgo" gde vidim sebe kako ležim i sobu, toga se i danas jasno sećam.
Što se tiče stvari, moram da podvučem da nisam video kevu kako ulazi u sobu (ili bar toga nisam bio svestan, ili se ne sećam ), već jednostavno kad se probudio znao sam da se te stvari na stolu - iz nekog razloga čim sam se probudio nagonski sam pogledao na tu stranu da se uverim da li su tu ili ne, jer sam opet iz nekog razloga znao da su tu (ili očekivao da budu, hebemliga). I meni je to sve konfuzno, nema smisla da se vi raspravljate o tome (mada mi vaša rasprava ne smeta).
Opet pitanje je da li su ovo dve pojave vezane, tj. ne isključujem mogućnost da sam se posle "pogleda odozgo" na sekundu polu-probudio da registrujem stvari i/ili ulazak keve u sobu, opet možda i ne. Ko će ga znati.

[sabahudin]

maznamsve, antimaterijo

[Lavinia Amaldi]

e,
a KEVE mi,
kao klinac, znao sam da letim, lebdim, onako po sobi, kevvve mi..
vremenom, zaboravih
jasno vam je da tada nisam poznavao nikake droge ili alkohol, o hipnozi, autosugestiji, masti etc. nista nisam znao, samo hooop, i letim...uha
jos sam nedavno i zenu ubedjivao, i decu, da sam to znao. mislim da mi je najmladja cerka poverovala.


manecnissdaeditujem

ludilo

[m]

Negdje sam jednom cuo da su kosti onih koje je SPC proglasila za svece zute, za razliku od kostiju svih ostalih smrtnika cije su kosti bijele. To je, koliko sam ja shvatio (pogresno?) i jedan od kriterijuma po kojima SPC proglasava nekog za sveca.

Moze li neko da mi objasni o cemu se u stvari radi?

Jel ljuska jajeta pretežno od kalcijuma, jeste.
Jesu ljudske kosti pretežno od kalcijuma, jesu.
Jel se jaja farbaju šafranom da dobiju žutu farbu, da.
Jesu popovi dovoljno ludi da pribegnu nečem sličnom ne bi li sebi podigli kredibilitet, jesu.

Eto o čemu se radi.

Kasandra za na Sveca!

[I Am Hell]

Kasandra za na Sveca!

___
___
???
___
___

[Braca]

Da ne ispadnem bas totalno arogantan, posluzicu se metaforom svetla i mraka :

Recimo da je ono sto neznamo mrak. Recimo da ono sto nauka moze da objasni predstavlja osvetljeni deo. Tokom istorije, "svetlo" se povecavalo i preslo put recimo od svece do jakog reflektora. Danas svetlo ipak nije toliko jako da je "sve" obasjalo i da nema mraka. Samim tim sto onaj deo koji nije osvetljen ne vidimo, ne mozemo reci ni koliki je ni sta predstavlja.

Ono sto mi smeta kod raznih zagovornika Tajni koji vole da se frljaju Velikim Slovima je sto tvrde da znaju i koliko je veliko to sto je u mraku, i kako je napravljeno, i sta predstavlja, i sta znaci, i kako utice na ovo u svetlu itd. A ne znaju, niti mogu da znaju, po samoj prirodi stvari. Mogu samo da pretpostavljaju. Ja (i drugi gore prozvani "sekularni humanisti") samo znamo da ne znamo.

P.S. I Einstein i Newton i ostali "veliki ljudi" su ipak samo ljudi, sa svim ljudskim slabostima i manama. Recimo, pored svojih briljantnih radova na polju fizike, Newton je mnogo vise vemena i energije utrosio na alhemiju, tj pokusaj da od olova napravi zlato(!).

Edited by Braca, 30 September 2003 - 14:04.

[Dunadan]

jes' Dragane, u pravu si; ne videh "specifikacije" tih sluchajnosti; beshe kasno, a pre toga sam odgledala Soderbergov Solaris tako da...
whatever, i za to se moze naci objashnjenje...logichko

Edited by DUNADAN, 30 September 2003 - 14:59.

[U prolazu]

A milion dolara? http://www.randi.org...arch/index.html
Misli li neko pokusat? Hajde ljudi pa da navijamo za njega/nju.

[Lavinia Amaldi]

P.S. I Einstein i Newton i ostali "veliki ljudi" su ipak samo ljudi, sa svim ljudskim slabostima i manama. Recimo, pored svojih briljantnih radova na polju fizike, Newton je mnogo vise vemena i energije utrosio na alhemiju, tj pokusaj da od olova napravi zlato(!).

don't pull my tong
salim se, naravno, ali "alhemija" je zanimljiva zar ne?

nego, ajde nek neko objasni (razumski, jel) slucaj mog brata od ujaka i smrti mog ujaka, koje je inace bio najstresniji dogadjaj u mom zivotu.
bash me zanima.
Moj brat Dejan, (to je bilo pre deset godina, preracunala sam se, tacnije 1994-te) je rekao da dok se "budio" iz anestezije, je video dva bica u belim haljinama??????, koja su mu rekla da je njegov otac umro. To je bilo toliko za njega REALNO, da nije bilo sanse da poveruje doktorima koji su ga smirivali da to nije tako, vristao je "vi mene lazete, ja znam da je on umro" itd, dok ujak u sred noci nije sa ujnom otisao do njega, da ga on vidi, da ej ziv. Moja sestra od ujaka me je zvala te noci (eto u familiji nemam pojma zasto uvek mene zovu kad tako nesto kao sta da radimo, ko da ja znam, mislim), ja sam naravno nju pokusala da smirim, kao ma to je sve zbog anestezije, ma kao daj iskuliraj, bice sve ok, i sl.
Moj ujak je sutradan uvece ustao posle odgledanog filma, rekao da ga boli glava, zaneo se, pao,, udario u vrata, odvezli su ga u bolnicu, na Urgentni, vratili se po njegova dokumenta hebem ti nase lekare i zdravstvo, dok su se vratili, on je vec sat vremena bio mrtav.Izliv krvi u mozak.
l MOLIM OBJASNJENJE.
HVALA.

[Braca]

Jedno od mogucih objasnjenja : tvoj ujak je imao problema sa krvnim sudovima za koje se nije znalo. Zna se da stres moze da ima stetne efekte na takve slucajeve. E sad zamisli dozu stresa kojem je tvoj ujak bio izlozen : sin u bolnici, operisan (pominjes anesteziju), koji trazi da ga vidi da bi se uverio da nije mrtav. Ne znam koliko je tvoj ujak verovao u "paranormalne" fenomene, ali zamisli da jeste bar malo, mozes zamisliti koliko se uplasio, sto za sina, sto za sebe. Zar ne mislis da moze biti dovoljno da izazove izliv krvi u mozak?

[Dragan]

„Oh, presvetli Sakyamuni Vi ste najveci Buda koji je ikada hodao zemljom“ – rece jedan novopridosli ucenik.
„Ti si onda sigurno poznavao sve Bude pre mene ?“ – upita ga Buda.
“Ne”
“Onda svakako sve Bude koji ce doci posle mene ?”
“Ne, ni njih”
“Kako onda mozes da tvrdis tako nesto ?”

Posto ni ja ne poznajem sve Bude moj odgovor na pitanje zasto niko ne prolazi pomenuti test ce naravno biti spekulativnog i teorijskog karaktera – u skladu sa unutrasnjom logikom ove oblasti.

Jednoga dana Krisna je na svom putu naisao na siroku reku. Jedna skela je upravo kretala na drugu stranu i on se pridruzio putnicima. Na sred reke videse odjednom nekog fakira kako hoda po vodi. Videvsi Krisnu na skeli ovaj se iznenadi i upita “O Lord, ja ovako mali pa mogu da hodam po vodi a ti moras skelom preko ?”. Na to ga Krisna upita koliko je godina vezbao da bi stekao tu osobinu i ovaj mu odgovori 15 godina napornog treninga.
Vidis meni je bilo dovoljno 5 rupija da predjem na drugu stranu !

Postoji jos jedna slicna verzija u kojoj se kaze da hodanje po vodi i nije neko narocito dostignuce jer svaki vilin konjic moze to isto da izvede.

Sve “magije” ovoga sveta (osim ljubavi) zasnivaju se na sposobnosti mentalne koncentracije.
Za ostvarivanje tih nizih moci nije neophodno pridrzavati se etickih pravila vec samo dovoljno uporno raditi.
1. Oni koji te moci imaju u vecoj meri i koriste ih u sebicne svrhe zaradjuju puno vise njihovom upotrebom u uobicajenim ekonomskim tokovima nego sto je taj milion – njihovo eksponiranje u javnosti na taj nacin samo bi im stetilo.
2. Oni koji su zainteresovani za duhovni razvoj (koji nije isto sto i razvoj parapsiholoskih sposobnosti iako se iste javljaju spontano i netrazeno) znaju da ih smeju upotrebiti samo za dobrobit drugih i da prikazivanje istih na vasarima ovoga sveta moze biti stetno i za njihov vlastiti razvoj i za razvoj drugih – ljudi se brzo zasite svakog cuda a da se u njima nista ne pokrene ili se ispunjeni strahom bace na spaljivanje i razapinjanje onog koji ometa njihov san
3. I postoji jedna velika grupa onih koji spadaju i u prvu i u drugu grupu kojima se ovakvi fenomeni javljaju povremeno i spontano. Posto njihove moci nisu voljne i stabilne onda je i verovatnoca uspeha u odredjenom trenutku, po komandi, mala, pogotovo sto je okolina apriori (kao sto se to moze primetiti na ovom forumu) ispunjena negativnim nabojem u odnosu na ove pojave. Kao sto se i “posmatranjem” neke male cestice ( a “posmatrati” mozemo samo ako je “osvetlimo” = dodamo joj odredjenu energiju ) menja njen polozaj i/ili energija tako i u sterilnim eksperimentalnim uslovima ispunjenih jos i skepsom (misli i emocije koje direktno uticu na rezultate eksperimenta – vecina tih cudnih pojava se zapravo i odigrava na nivoima emocija i misli koji su isto toliko realni kao i fizicki svet) verovatnoca da ce eksperiment uspeti tezi ka nuli.

Pri svemu tome ne treba zaboraviti ni vojne i tajne agencije koje su izgleda veoma zainteresovane za tako nesto. Ne bih voleo biti u kozi onoga koga se oni dohvate za eksperimentisanje. Nesto od moguce problematike se moze videti u SF filmovima (Brainstrom i jos nekoliko kojima ne znam imena).

Posto se covecanstvo kao celina krece prirodnim tokom razvoja tih, sada “skrivenih”, osobina a nauka otkriva sve suptilnije metode merenja veoma je verovatno da ce uskoro doci dan kada ce se kvantitet (sve veci broj onih koji svedoce takve pojave) prerasti u kvalitet (naucna dokazivost tj. merljivost tih pojava).

No u krajnjoj liniji sve to i nije bitno. Najvaznije je da svako od nas nadje svoj put ka vlastitoj sreci.

PS
Braco, u ovome sto je Lavinija napisala naglasak nije na tome da je ujak umro vec na onome sto je Dejan doziveo...
PSS
Ovim sam otprilike rekao sve sto sam imao da kazem o ovoj temi.

Edited by Dragan, 01 October 2003 - 00:20.

[Hippie]

.....jako lep text Dragane ...sad sam tek stigla da procitam sve ...

[Braca]

Dragane, cela prica "ima smisla" zato sto je ujak stvarno umro. Koliko njih imaju razne "vizije", sanjaju/vide nesto slicno, pogotovo pod uticajem jakih narkotika koji se koriste za anesteziju, pa to niko ne "zabelezi" zato sto se ustanovi da su to ipak samo snovi/vizije.

[indira]

Dragan, only for your eyes !

Film koji znam na temu koju si pomenuo a novijeg ne datuma : "Hearts in Atlantis", po knjizi Steven Kinga. Knjiga je kao i obicno mnogo bolja, spada strogo u SF.

Ali ovo nije SF.

V. Lopatin , V. Cygankov: Psychotronic Weapon and the Security of Russia
Publishing house : SINTEG, Moscow, Russian Federation, 1999
Chapter 7 - Legislational Problems and the Psychotronical Weapon, datum: novembar 2001

".....Those are the excerpts from the first chapter of the book of the
Russian politician, V.N. Lopatin, head of the parliamentary comission
on information, who, last year, presented to the Russian State Duma
the draft of the law on informational and psychological security of
Russia. The draft calculated with possible mind control attack at the
population of Russia by the potential enemy. It is not yet clear
whether the law has been discussed or voted on in the Russian State
Duma. The co- author of the book is the scientist, V.D. Tsygankov,
specialized in the construction of neurocomputers.

"Theoretical works appeared, confirming the reality of
PSI-phenomena, the existence of so called torsion component in the
right part of of the gravitational equation by A. Einstein (19), and
the construction of technical models of the torsion fields radiation
generators is reported in some works (20, 2). All such publications
and communications talk about the possibility to use the presented
PSI-phenomena with the intent to attack as well as with the intent of
the perfection of the defense of the government and its means of
armament. . The following PSI phenomena of human being and animals are
the object of the study:

x prediction of future
x secret reading of the present and past time
x hypnotical effects and zombieng
x search and finding of indicated lost objects

The basic problems of the construction and areas of the use of
psychotronic weapon result from those:

x construction and use of military PSI generators
x collecting of inteligence (PSI-detectors)
x construction and use of battlefield PSI generators
x construction and use of TSULIPs - centers for control of people
and apparatus - basic system of communication:
networks of telephone, radio and television broadcasting; system of
torsion communication and radiation, i.e. networks of PSI effects.
x construction of bioautomats-robots

Building of models and analogs of PSI-abilities and phenomena - the
task whic is nowadays in the order of the day.

PSI weapon this is the "ray weapon" (powerfull generators, radiating
pencils of rays, serving as a striking factor) and ENERGO-
INFORMATIONAL CURRENTS OF RADIATION ORGANIZED
IN A SPECIAL WAY (coherently), of known as well as unknown
physical nature...."
".....The fundamental wave equation of QM, the equation by Schrodinger,
contains the mathematical symbol of the greek letter PSI defining
the wave function which describes the undulatory behavior of
quantum mechanical object (ensemble). It is believed that the
processes and the mechanisms of consciousness (thinking), the
processes of subconsciousness (under the threshold processes),
i.e. all psychic processes in the brain, are governed by
quantum-mechanical laws. Aside from that a much more sophisticated
scientific discipline came into being - scientific and technical
PSI-quantum mechanical discipline of the research and control of
the mechanisms and laws of thinking and psyche at the MICRO-level -
the level of elementary particles and physical vacuum (19).

So the two apparently opposed worlds or levels, MACRO world and
MICRO world, enter the worlds of thinking, consciousness and psyche.

The ways and methods of their research and the control of their
intimate mechanisms merged into a single, more sophisticated problem,
the problem of identification and control of the condition of
consciousness and psyche. .. . The theory of physical vacuum by G.I.
Shipov (19) unites the general theory of relativity by A. Einstein
and quantum mechanics by Heisenberg, Schrodinger, Dirac and offers
to the designers and researchers the key to the construction of the
power means which could act upon the topology and structure of the
space-time. The possibility emerges to build unusually powerfull and
effective means of coherent radiation and destruction of targets and
as well of high-manoevrable and economic flying apparatus (FA) and
aero-cosmic complexes (of the type of flying saucers . (23), see
appendix 1 as well). .. As a result of the solution of the PSI
problem numerous means usable with mercenary objectives as means of
violence, attack, subjugation and blackmail have been produced and
their production continues intensively.

1.2 Psychotronic Weapon and Psychotronic War

Definition 1. Psychotronic weapon (PSW) - any means of intensive
effect upon the brain of a single human being or mass of people, upon
the flora and fauna, upon plants, animals, upon the environment
(liquid and gaseous)..with the objective of the disturbance of their
normal condition and functioning

Definition 2. Psychotronic war - the mass use of PSW aginst the
state or its part. .. We will begin by presenting one of the possible
classification of PSW:

1. According to their use: strategic, tactical,individual (personal)

2. According to the strategy and tactics of the use:
offensive, defensive

3. According to the scale of the destructive effect:
mass destruction, highly targeted local effect

4. According to energetical factor:
- subliminal, extrasensory, subliminal (unenergetical)
- weak electromagnetic biofields and other radiations ...
- superstrong coherent power-energy fields and radiations,
producing catastrophic perturbations of ecological scale
- topological means, deforming structure and characteristics
of the space-time

5. According to the target in the living object:
- sensory, extrasensory influences at the system of perception
(inputs)
- psychokinestetical
- motorinfluences at motions and displacemnent (output)
- extrasensory effects at the processes of decision making,
at the personal "I" (central)

6. According to the duration of the effect:
- short time, reversible
- longtime effects
- irreversible, pathological effects, defeating the psyche

7. According to the outcome of the effect
- non lethal
- lethal (with lethal outcome)

8. According to the controlability

- controllable by an inductor or generator with the
use of commands
- uncontrollable, of a single effect...."

".....Government structures, organizations and companies
preoccupied with the PSI problem in the USA (28):

x The Department of Defense of the USA
x Office of Intelligence at the Department of Defense of the USA
x DARPA agency at the Department of Defense of the USA
x Airforce, Navy and land forces of the army of the USA
x The Center of Military Research (Redstone)
x Research and Science Institute of behavioral and social
sciences of land forces of the USA
x American Association for the Development of Science
x The company RAND
x The company Westinghouse
x The company General Electric
x The company Bell Telephone Company
x Stanford Science Research Institute and many tens of other
institutions

The following countries carry out research in this area: USA, Great
Brittain, France, Germany, Japan, China, Vietnam, Izrael, Italy,
Hungary, Roumania, Bulgary, Russia, Ukraine (more than 30 countries in
the world).

Five basic directions of military research in the area of
bioenergoinformatics and PSI phenomena can be defined:

1) Works on methods of premeditated influence at psychical activity
of human being (29)

2) Fundamental theoretical and experimental research studying the
clairvoyance and telekinesis in military applications (gathering of
intelligence and sabotage activity) (29)

3) Study of the influence of bioradiation on military and commercial
control and communication systems, on military electronic apparatus,
work on bioenergetic generators capable to influence the staff of
armies. (30)

4) Work on systems capable to detect and control (systems of
monitoring) artificial and factual dangerous bioradiations and methods
of active and passive defense against them. (103,104).

Work on measuring devices and metrological services and methods of
evaluation of such phenomena and effects. Modeling of PSI effects and
biocommunication. (28) Construction, on the line of aerospace
agencies and NASA in the USA, of power systems destinated for military
defense of the type of newer effective lethal apparatus (LA), making
use of the possibility of the transformation of topology of the
space-time and the control of gravitation. (23)..."


On this subject see: Materials of Parliamentary Hearings
"Threats and Challenges in the Area of Informational Security",
Moscow, July 1996, Informational Weapon as a Threat to National
Security of Russia (Analytical Report of SVR of the Russian
Federation, Moscow 1996), To Whom will Belong the Conscienscious
Weapon in the 21st century?, Moscow, 1997, V.N. Tsygichko, G.L.
Smolian, D. Ts. Chereshkin - "Informational weapon as a
geopolitical factor and instrument of the politics of power",
Moscow, 1997./


Ima toga mnogo, knjiga,dokumenata, poslacu ti zanimljive detalje(imam par prijatelja, likova koji su ucestovovali u navedenim programima,uvijek zanimljivo cuti nesto novo iz prve ruke) , ja ne-humanista, ne-sekularac, tebi my friend, 100% sekularnom humanisti:)), za pravo da mislimo razlicito. Nastavicemo dosadni razgovor privatno, da ljude ne uvlacim u svoj mrak.